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	<title>Comments on: Facebook Ate the PC Download Game Model</title>
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	<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/</link>
	<description>All About the Data Around Marketing, Social Media, Games and More</description>
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		<title>By: Like a Kid in a Candy Store : EveryJoe - Sports News &#8211; Tech Reviews &#8211; Entertainment &#8211; Life Tips for EveryJoe</title>
		<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/comment-page-1/#comment-936</link>
		<dc:creator>Like a Kid in a Candy Store : EveryJoe - Sports News &#8211; Tech Reviews &#8211; Entertainment &#8211; Life Tips for EveryJoe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 01:55:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/?p=410#comment-936</guid>
		<description>[...] I bring up the casual games idea after reading a piece by Eric von Coelln about Facebook eating the PC Download game model. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I bring up the casual games idea after reading a piece by Eric von Coelln about Facebook eating the PC Download game model. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: EVCinNYC</title>
		<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/comment-page-1/#comment-935</link>
		<dc:creator>EVCinNYC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 01:17:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/?p=410#comment-935</guid>
		<description>Thanks for mentioning the additional sites: BigSeaGames.com is very roughly estimated at 30 to 50K per day by quantcast while Fuanashpere.com hasn&#039;t registered yet (which I assume would be smaller).  Someone else mentioned I missed Kongregate on the list above.  They came in at 157K US users per day (they have 444K Intl traffic, so a split with a bit less US than Facebook).

No question the US economy isn&#039;t helping a model where you have to pay to play past the one hour demo, but I would expect to see growth in the free flash game portals and MiniClip and Addicting Games are down while Kongregate is pretty flat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for mentioning the additional sites: BigSeaGames.com is very roughly estimated at 30 to 50K per day by quantcast while Fuanashpere.com hasn&#8217;t registered yet (which I assume would be smaller).  Someone else mentioned I missed Kongregate on the list above.  They came in at 157K US users per day (they have 444K Intl traffic, so a split with a bit less US than Facebook).</p>
<p>No question the US economy isn&#8217;t helping a model where you have to pay to play past the one hour demo, but I would expect to see growth in the free flash game portals and MiniClip and Addicting Games are down while Kongregate is pretty flat.</p>
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		<title>By: James Buckhouse</title>
		<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/comment-page-1/#comment-934</link>
		<dc:creator>James Buckhouse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 16:34:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/?p=410#comment-934</guid>
		<description>Great post! 

I recently posted an interesting report on monetizing Freemuim games. You can check it out here: 

http://socialmonetization.blogspot.com/2009/09/free-to-pay.html 

As with everything on the internet, things change. If you have great content, why not port? 

The key is to architect your games for portability - it takes more time up front, but their is a big pay-off in two key directions: 

1) You can build additional games more easily based on your initial &quot;backbone&quot; architecture. 

2) You can more easily port your games to a new platform. 

So if something replaces Facebook next month, you will still have products to sell. If a greater phone than the iphone appears, you&#039;ll be ready.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post! </p>
<p>I recently posted an interesting report on monetizing Freemuim games. You can check it out here: </p>
<p><a href="http://socialmonetization.blogspot.com/2009/09/free-to-pay.html" rel="nofollow">http://socialmonetization.blogspot.com/2009/09/free-to-pay.html</a> </p>
<p>As with everything on the internet, things change. If you have great content, why not port? </p>
<p>The key is to architect your games for portability &#8211; it takes more time up front, but their is a big pay-off in two key directions: </p>
<p>1) You can build additional games more easily based on your initial &#8220;backbone&#8221; architecture. </p>
<p>2) You can more easily port your games to a new platform. </p>
<p>So if something replaces Facebook next month, you will still have products to sell. If a greater phone than the iphone appears, you&#8217;ll be ready.</p>
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		<title>By: Penny Gamer</title>
		<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/comment-page-1/#comment-932</link>
		<dc:creator>Penny Gamer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 15:41:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/?p=410#comment-932</guid>
		<description>I wonder what percentage of Big Fish&#039;s declining numbers are the result of increased pressure from social games and how much is from the collapse of the US economy. Not to mention, you are looking at traffic here...Big Fish rolled out two new sites (Faunasphere and Big Sea Games) in the past six months. How many of their users are on those portals rather than Big Fish proper?

Certainly, there are people choosing to game on Facebook rather than Big Fish / Pogo / whoever. Sounds to me like casual games better start innovating their games or get their butts on Facebook.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder what percentage of Big Fish&#8217;s declining numbers are the result of increased pressure from social games and how much is from the collapse of the US economy. Not to mention, you are looking at traffic here&#8230;Big Fish rolled out two new sites (Faunasphere and Big Sea Games) in the past six months. How many of their users are on those portals rather than Big Fish proper?</p>
<p>Certainly, there are people choosing to game on Facebook rather than Big Fish / Pogo / whoever. Sounds to me like casual games better start innovating their games or get their butts on Facebook.</p>
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		<title>By: EVCinNYC</title>
		<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/comment-page-1/#comment-929</link>
		<dc:creator>EVCinNYC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Sep 2009 03:02:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/?p=410#comment-929</guid>
		<description>Good point Daniel regarding the data from Quantcast - these are definitely estimates.  I also was concerned about using August data -- that&#039;s typically the worst season for download sales as the target audience is usually on vacation or dealing with their kids on vacation -- but BFG seemed to buck that trend over the last two years which made me feel more comfortable with the comparison.  Site traffic also is very dependent on a game release - if a new Mystery Case Files game is launched, they are likely to see a spike.  

I agree BFG and others will move to innovate.  Dana&#039;s point above about using Facebook Connect to pass along achievements in download games is a definite short-term possibility.  Some of the MMOs like the new Atari Champions Online are already doing this, although I&#039;m seeing users turn it off because it spams the Facebook account too much.  

I think the hard part for developers though is supporting this individually and believe that there is a great market opportunity for someone to provide APIs for developers to integrate in their games, so the devs can focus on building the game (and the marketers on the messaging/content strategy) and not having to build the infrastructure from scratch.

PS - Thank you for sharing with us all your data from March on your metrics (&lt;a href=http://thefloggingwillcontinue.com/ rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://thefloggingwillcontinue.com/&lt;/a&gt;); it was great to get another perspective to benchmark how we were doing at Power Challenge.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good point Daniel regarding the data from Quantcast &#8211; these are definitely estimates.  I also was concerned about using August data &#8212; that&#8217;s typically the worst season for download sales as the target audience is usually on vacation or dealing with their kids on vacation &#8212; but BFG seemed to buck that trend over the last two years which made me feel more comfortable with the comparison.  Site traffic also is very dependent on a game release &#8211; if a new Mystery Case Files game is launched, they are likely to see a spike.  </p>
<p>I agree BFG and others will move to innovate.  Dana&#8217;s point above about using Facebook Connect to pass along achievements in download games is a definite short-term possibility.  Some of the MMOs like the new Atari Champions Online are already doing this, although I&#8217;m seeing users turn it off because it spams the Facebook account too much.  </p>
<p>I think the hard part for developers though is supporting this individually and believe that there is a great market opportunity for someone to provide APIs for developers to integrate in their games, so the devs can focus on building the game (and the marketers on the messaging/content strategy) and not having to build the infrastructure from scratch.</p>
<p>PS &#8211; Thank you for sharing with us all your data from March on your metrics (<a href=http://thefloggingwillcontinue.com/ rel="nofollow">http://thefloggingwillcontinue.com/</a>); it was great to get another perspective to benchmark how we were doing at Power Challenge.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel James</title>
		<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/comment-page-1/#comment-928</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel James</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Sep 2009 01:52:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/?p=410#comment-928</guid>
		<description>I agree with your analysis, but I think it&#039;s worth pointing out that Quantcast&#039;s numbers (like compete, etc.) are thought to be ~1/3rd of the real numbers for most sites, whereas the FB DAU numbers are believe to be pretty accurate. That said, the trend is definitely there, and I think you&#039;ll see Big Fish and others aggressively respond in the next year.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with your analysis, but I think it&#8217;s worth pointing out that Quantcast&#8217;s numbers (like compete, etc.) are thought to be ~1/3rd of the real numbers for most sites, whereas the FB DAU numbers are believe to be pretty accurate. That said, the trend is definitely there, and I think you&#8217;ll see Big Fish and others aggressively respond in the next year.</p>
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		<title>By: dana</title>
		<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/comment-page-1/#comment-927</link>
		<dc:creator>dana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 22:53:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/?p=410#comment-927</guid>
		<description>Good points, Eric. In addition to your comment that &quot;games on Facebook have the ability to continually change and keep users engaged&quot;, the other pertinent quality that casual PC downloads don&#039;t have is the &quot;social&quot; aspect. I wonder if more PC download developers integrated social actions &amp; Facebook Connect right into the download - so you could share your scores and achievements and invite others in your Facebook network to join you right from the download - if our traditional model would become more sustainable and people would actually still purchase the games because they are no longer solo experiences. It doesn&#039;t make sense for &quot;social gaming&quot; to have to be totally enclosed within a single network. All the portals would then be in even more heated competition to get the download associated with their brand to be played more/shared more/more visible - kind of like natural search rankings, but within Facebook news feeds. 

I could also see the big portals you mentioned using their fan pages to build their Facebook communities around the download games they offer via their portal. Imagine if the new Women&#039;s Murder Club game, for example, offered ways to not only share your your findings, achievements and actions within the game to your news feed, but MSN Games got an exclusive build where users could post comments about certain mini-games or levels right to their fan page. Then other fans who visit the page see fans interacting not just with &#039;MSN Games&#039; but with other fans playing and sharing information about a specific game in real time that is connected only to the MSN brand. Would that incentivize more downloads, and in turn purchases? What if a full-version purchase enabled you to interact more on Facebook than you can in the trial version? 

I&#039;m sure there are some untapped possibilities in download gaming that could make it more social and developers/portals could still make money from purchases.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good points, Eric. In addition to your comment that &#8220;games on Facebook have the ability to continually change and keep users engaged&#8221;, the other pertinent quality that casual PC downloads don&#8217;t have is the &#8220;social&#8221; aspect. I wonder if more PC download developers integrated social actions &amp; Facebook Connect right into the download &#8211; so you could share your scores and achievements and invite others in your Facebook network to join you right from the download &#8211; if our traditional model would become more sustainable and people would actually still purchase the games because they are no longer solo experiences. It doesn&#8217;t make sense for &#8220;social gaming&#8221; to have to be totally enclosed within a single network. All the portals would then be in even more heated competition to get the download associated with their brand to be played more/shared more/more visible &#8211; kind of like natural search rankings, but within Facebook news feeds. </p>
<p>I could also see the big portals you mentioned using their fan pages to build their Facebook communities around the download games they offer via their portal. Imagine if the new Women&#8217;s Murder Club game, for example, offered ways to not only share your your findings, achievements and actions within the game to your news feed, but MSN Games got an exclusive build where users could post comments about certain mini-games or levels right to their fan page. Then other fans who visit the page see fans interacting not just with &#8216;MSN Games&#8217; but with other fans playing and sharing information about a specific game in real time that is connected only to the MSN brand. Would that incentivize more downloads, and in turn purchases? What if a full-version purchase enabled you to interact more on Facebook than you can in the trial version? </p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure there are some untapped possibilities in download gaming that could make it more social and developers/portals could still make money from purchases.</p>
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		<title>By: EVCinNYC</title>
		<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/comment-page-1/#comment-926</link>
		<dc:creator>EVCinNYC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 17:47:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/?p=410#comment-926</guid>
		<description>Sweet!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sweet!</p>
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		<title>By: EVCinNYC</title>
		<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/comment-page-1/#comment-925</link>
		<dc:creator>EVCinNYC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 17:46:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/?p=410#comment-925</guid>
		<description>Thanks!  Agree with you that monetizing flash games is contributing, but the traffic at sites like MiniClip and Addicting Games had dropped dramatically over the last year and a half (both were around 1.6 million at one point).  While I&#039;m intrigued on micro transaction side, I&#039;m not completely sold on the ad-supported model (there&#039;s too much content, not enough advertisers wanting to take the risk, which leads publishers to take on some brand-killing lower tier ads).

The real difference here is that social mass market games on Facebook have the ability to continually change and keep users engaged - sort of the mash up of MMOs and casual games.  PC Download, Flash and iPhone games can&#039;t really do that.

Enjoying your</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks!  Agree with you that monetizing flash games is contributing, but the traffic at sites like MiniClip and Addicting Games had dropped dramatically over the last year and a half (both were around 1.6 million at one point).  While I&#8217;m intrigued on micro transaction side, I&#8217;m not completely sold on the ad-supported model (there&#8217;s too much content, not enough advertisers wanting to take the risk, which leads publishers to take on some brand-killing lower tier ads).</p>
<p>The real difference here is that social mass market games on Facebook have the ability to continually change and keep users engaged &#8211; sort of the mash up of MMOs and casual games.  PC Download, Flash and iPhone games can&#8217;t really do that.</p>
<p>Enjoying your</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/2009/09/18/facebook-ate-the-pc-download-game-model/comment-page-1/#comment-923</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 17:06:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/?p=410#comment-923</guid>
		<description>Eric - Great stuff! I even added a link to it to my newsletter for this week :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Eric &#8211; Great stuff! I even added a link to it to my newsletter for this week <img src='http://www.voncoelln.com/eric/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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